marvel and dc counterparts

Well, no, but they really do bear a great... 9 The Undertaker – Ghost Rider. However, like Zarda, Hyperion was given new life (as in, his own) in the pages of Supreme Power. One of the coolest things about the way these guys were brought back is how, well-- cool they were. It would seem that Marvel drew their inspiration from DC here, but interestingly, that isn’t the case. She has an obsession with Buffy the Vampire Slayer and enjoys bullying people into playing the Buffy board game. Regardless of where they started out their hero’s journey, or villain's in Clint’s case, both wound up key members of the premier superhero squad in their universes. Speaking of both Squadron Supreme and Supreme Power, Hyperion is another hero that began as a thinly veiled attempt to copy a DC hero, only to later be reimagined into something else entirely. Let us know in the comments! Then they both became heroes. There are many DC and Marvel heroes with equivalent power sets. For most of the part, both the Warner Bros. and Marvel Studios have consistently hit the nail when it comes to casting, actors for the role. She was taken from her mother at a young age and groomed by Granny Goodness to lead the Female Furies, Darkseid’s fiercest warriors. Jordan was pretty much the cockiest dude ever, while Rider was a shy kid (although becoming Nova increased his self-confidence). Despite the fact that both men returned under unfortunate circumstances, they are now both heroes. Also, their costumes bear a certain uncanny resemblance and these two ladies have each walked the line between villain and anti-hero. It's kind of the greatest rip off in comic book history! Not only were their costumes cut from the same cloth (if not color scheme), but so were their names. Aside from that, Big Barda and Gamora are far more powerful then most of the men they fight beside (fairly uncharacteristic of the time during which they were created). This was the only life she knew. The most well known: a boy with Superman’s power set, who happened to be an alien sent to Earth from a dying planet and was raised by a kindly couple. However, the evolution of the characters is vastly different. While their fellow heroes were falling in and out of love, these two men were happily settled down (at least until Ralph tragically lost his wife in the pages of Identity Crisis). The Vision, on the other hand, can do pretty much anything. Regardless of their personalities, their place in their respective galaxies is the same. Marc Spector is no carbon copy of Bruce Wayne, but the similarities are hard to miss. They are both fierce warriors with near identical power sets. Do you prefer the DC or Marvel versions? Often one isn’t better than the other and let’s face it, without this rivalry, we would’ve most likely missed out on some truly exceptional stories. Out with the Westerns and in with the superheroes. 10 WWE Wrestlers & Their Marvel/DC Counterparts 10 Roman Reigns – Aquaman. Next up, both have serious romantic ties to the heroes headlining the books they first appeared in, Batman and Spider-Man. This is an extremely common superpower in both universes. First of all, they both have that whole cat thing going on. Antman:The atom. Whereas the “DC Extended Universe is opening its footing, and the MCU keeps on growing from strength to strength as it expands. Atom & Ant-Man: Troubled Scientists Who Invented Suits That Allow For Extreme Changes In … Well, that would be death. This was an intentional riff on Deathstroke's name, Slade Wilson. No one strained too many muscles there. While his origin was largely the same, rather than being brought up by people who instilled an unwavering sense of morality in him, it was the government that found Milton. Here are 15 DC and Marvel Characters Who Are Strikingly Similar. Jamie Gerber is a writer for Screen Rant, The Quiz and Psycho Drive-In. Following that, he was plagued by problems in both his professional and personal life. He also died in an explosion (although he was pretty much beaten to death first.). Another substantial aspect these two characters share: their marriages. Doom Patrol made their first appearance in My Greatest Adventure #80 in June, while X-Men #1 debuted in September. Marvel and DC Comics Counterparts Each pair of counterparts are based on either personality, abilities or lifestyle. The ‘60s was very much a time of reinvention for comics. DC's Vandal Savage has a Marvel equivalent in the form of Marvel's Ulysses Bloodstone. However, in recent years, Geoff Johns has done an excellent job of reinventing Aquaman, while Namor has remained largely underused. We've decided to highlight just how bad it can get at times, these are the most shameless Marvel and DC analogs. It is their power sets that truly differentiate them. Also, let’s not forget that an older gentleman in a wheelchair led both teams and that they were described as the world's "Strangest Heroes”. Marvel and DC Comics have been rivals for decades. Comparing Marvel Characters To Their Mortal Kombat Counterparts. Man Thing on the other hand, has remained largely unchanged since his inception. Marvel & DC Counterparts. Red Tornado dated Kathleen Sutton and the two adopted a daughter. Iron man:Batman. Gamora was also raised to serve an evil ruler: her adoptive father Thanos (basically the Marvel equivalent of Darkseid). But ultimately, this batch of 16 actors certainly didn’t look like their comic book counterparts. Marvel and DC Comics have had their share of fun crossovers, allowing readers to see battles between Superman and Thor or team-ups between Spider-Man and Batman. Initially, when you think about these two great warriors, not that many similarities spring to mind. by valan Plays Quiz not verified by Sporcle . Justice League of America. The usual suspects have been covered, so I will be talking about some of the lesser-known characters: #1: The Angry, Grumbling Brutes Solomon Grundy was inspired by the rage monster from Marvel. Wisely, J. Michael Straczynski and Gary Frank chose to reimagine Zarda in the brilliant Supreme Power, an update of Squadron Supreme, which definitely gave the character her own identity. Doom Patrol were freaks, while the X-Men were mutants labeled as freaks. Despite serving in many important storylines since their creation, the two have been relegated to relatively minor roles in their respective universes. They also both had happy marriages that ended in bitter divorce. Get Random Most Shameless Marvel/DC Counterparts & Analogs - Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, right? Avengers and justice league . … More so than any pair on this list, these two men have carved out their own separate niches in comics. Not only were both men married to ladies named Sue (Storm and Dearbon), but also their relationships have been relatively trouble free. According to creator Marv Wolfram, he got the idea for Felicia Hardy from a Tex Avery cartoon from the ‘40s, called Bad Luck Blackie. Poor Jason Todd, aka everyone’s least favorite Robin, was killed off essentially by the fans, whose wishes were carried out by the psychotic Joker. There have been several versions of the character. She aspires to write about the things that she loves at a job that can support her massive Thai take-out addiction. They were both created by villains that were attempting to use them against the Justice League and the Avengers, respectively. Both Bruce Wayne and Marc Spector are pretty much the masks, while Batman and Moon Knight are who these guys really are. At the end of May, DC is planning on releasing Swamp Thing, a series on the titular character. Aside from all that, Zarda, like Diana, fell in love with pretty much the first guy she met. They allowed him to be raised like a normal kid, all the while monitoring him and calling the shots, wanting only to use him as a weapon. Although she has a couple of somewhat close counterparts in the Marvel Universe, perhaps Thor or Captain Marvel, none share quite as many similarities with Diana Prince as Power Princess. Namor and Arthur are considered royalty and their responsibilities to their kingdoms have always taken precedence over what goes on in the surface world. Deathstroke and Deadpool are master assassins who wield both guns and swords, and have regenerative capabilities. The two share little in common personality wise, but that is literally the only thing that separates them. Marvel and DC have even acknowledged these... coincidences at times, like the Amalgam universe where they met their alternate universe counterpart. Two almost identical characters conceived by two different publishers at the same time! Deathstroke and Deadpool don't just have dissimilar backstories; their personalities are also absolutely nothing alike. Aside from that, each of them was regarded as top-notch in their fields. Catwoman was completely redesigned in Frank Miller and David Mazzucchelli’s Batman: Year One, which wasn’t released until 1986. Although Selina sported a catsuit in the campy ‘60s Batman TV show, her comic counterpart was stilling wearing a purple dress. The go-to source for comic book and superhero movie fans. While their abilities aren’t quite the same, they both have nearly unlimited power, which each one receives from a specific power source. Both Clint and Ollie have been involved with ladies whose superhero sobriquet begins with the word Black (Widow and Canary, respectively). Putting their stretching capabilities aside (their power set is pretty much identical), one of the most important qualities they share is their incredible intellect. 6. While there are many heroes that share certain characteristics with the Dark Knight, none are quite so apparent as Moon… Welcome to the most complete and satisfying Marvel & DC Counterparts comparison on internet. Bucky Barnes died a tragic, but heroic death while trying to defuse a bomb during WWII. A few months isn’t much time to steal an idea and execute it. She takes far too many pictures of both her dog and her horse, and prefers spending time with them to hanging out with actual human beings. The Vision married the Scarlet Witch and they had two children (who she essentially willed into existence). Hyperion was initially conceived as a villainous version of the Man of Steel. Every DC character seems to have a Marvel counterpart, but there are many for whom the similarities run much deeper than a power set. It is true that over the years the books have deviated enough that they are now completely separate entities, and if you haven’t read Grant Morrison’s run on both titles, you’re missing out! Aside from all that, they have both fallen for human women. So the story goes: Niceieza took one look the sketches of this Deadpool character and said, "This is Deathstroke from the Teen Titans." Marvel & DC Counterparts. The most impossible situation Green Arrow and Hawkeye have escaped? Jamie loves all things pop culture and believes her life would be meaningless without a soundtrack. Although the two heroes have very different backstories, they share quite a bit in common besides that whole bow and arrow thing (although let’s face it, that’s kind of a big one). Bucky eventually came to his senses and has been a hero ever since, even doing a brief stint as Captain America! Marvel Comics is a comic book publishing company that created many iconic superheroes such as Spider-Man, Iron Man, Wolverine, Hulk, Captain America, etc.They are the main competition for DC Comics, and most of their characters were created primarily by the late Stan Lee, Jack Kirby, and Steve Ditko. The Atom and Ant-Man each started out with shrinking technology, but later discovered that they could grow themselves as well. The two men both needed to teach themselves archery for survival from a fairly young age. Fantastic (1961’s Fantastic Four #1) / DC’s Plastic Man (1941’s Police Comics … This infamous knockoff is known to most comic fans already. Arguably, Jason and Bucky were fairly lame characters before their deaths, but upon their returns they became two of the most awesome badasses in comics. Red Tornado turned on his maker, T.O. Let’s get the obvious out of the way first. Sometimes Marvel comes out on top (MCU) and sometimes DC is the one that gets bragging rights (TV). Spider-Man is one of Horikoshi's biggest inspirations, if not the biggest. Despite getting her English degree years ago, she can’t seem to leave her job at the comic shop. They both use their wealth to fight crime with an interesting array of gadgets and have no superpowers to speak of. Cute DC and Marvel counterparts. Spector is basically that broken psyche taken one step further, with him descending into actual madness. It all started with Rob Liefeld's designs for the assassin that he and co-creator Fabian Nicieza wanted to incorporate into New Mutants. Although their career choices differ, they are two of the smartest men in the Marvel and DC Universes. However, both Jordan and Rider were granted their new titles by a dying member of the Corps. 5. Rate 5 stars Rate 4 stars Rate 3 stars Rate 2 stars Rate 1 star . Are Roman Reigns and Jason Momoa lost brothers? However, at their inception, the teams were unmistakably alike. Marvel/DC counterparts. Interestingly, these two dead sidekicks turned anti-heroes were resurrected in the same year. In the soap operatic world of comics, that is a huge feat! They basically act as space cops. How to Play. Jason partially redeemed himself over time and was reimagined with Red Hood and the Outlaws during DC’s New 52. There have been a couple incarnations of both of these guys, but the two with the most in common are Ray Palmer and Hank Pym (both of the Silver Age). Horikoshi has stated that the web-slinging… Entertainment Quiz / Marvel vs DC Counterparts Random Entertainment or Marvel Cinematic Universe Quiz Can you match the almost equal counterparts? Both were born of Atlantean women who fell in love with mortal men. Although these are obvious parallels, the men are not too different underneath their disguises either. Obviously, it’s easy to lump the two sea guys together, but the parallels go far beyond their affinity for the ocean. Dc Counterpart: Justice League of America. 197 likes. Both are immortals who gained their powers from meteorites and both have daughters that debuted in the 2000s (Scandal Savage for Vandal, Elsa Bloodstone for Ulysses). Both were bands of misfits fighting on behalf of a populace that feared and hated them. Eventually, she became a valued member of the Justice League. When you get down to it, the similarities are fairly astounding. Photo: Chris Foulkes / via deviantart. It is true that Hal Jordan (the Silver Age GL) and Richard Rider are completely different guys. Once Hyperion learns about his life of deception, he finds his own way and his journey there is an awesome one! They were ripped straight from the pages of the comics. ... I’ll bet a penny and a pot of gold that you’re probably a fan of Marvel Comics and Mortal Kombat. Wonder Woman grew up on Themyscira, while Zarda lived her early years on Utopia. That’s hardly the end of the comparison though. The main difference is that Namor can fly. Here is another pair of heroes whose similarities are immediately apparent. Get Random Most Shameless Marvel/DC Counterparts & Analogs - Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, right? While those early stories were great, it was Alan Moore (Watchmen), who took over the book in its second volume, that made the Swamp Thing so much more. Welcome to the most complete and satisfying Marvel & DC Counterparts comparison on internet. Marvel may have, admittedly, drawn a little too much inspiration from the DC character, but they most definitely made him their own. Selina Kyle and Felicia Hardy are instantly recognizable as kindred spirits. Liefeld had grown up a huge fan of the Titans and the similarities were unmistakable. Oscar Wilde once said, “Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” The House of Ideas can run out of inspiration, just as the Distinguished Competitor can lose the plot. Over the past few years, many actors have taken on the role of superheroes in the DC and Marvel film universes. They are both physicists who used their newfound powers to become superheroes. Please log in again. Not long after, a different iteration of Hyperion, known as Mark Milton, showed up on the superhero team, Squadron Supreme. Both Alec Holland and Theodore “Ted” Sallis were scientists. Clint has been an Avenger through countless iterations of the team and the same can be said of Ollie and the Justice League. However, their creator, the late Arnold Drake, was convinced that Stan Lee did steal the idea. Both men are outspoken and known to be impetuous. Both characters acted as backup to two of the biggest heroes of their respective publishing companies, Batman and Captain America. Women are presented differently than their male counterparts, typically wearing revealing clothing that showcases their curves and cleavage and showing a lot of skin in some cases. Both men are driven by vengeance, although for Batman, this is on behalf of his parents, while for Moon Knight, it is the god Khonshu for whom he battles. DC Counterpart: Barry Allen, Bart Allen, Wally West, Jay Garrick Both Marvel and DC have plenty of characters that run at super-speeds. Aside from powers, the two men share the same weakness: they cannot exist indefinitely on land. Both men also returned in a manner that pitted them against their former mentors. Second, both are thieves and not just competent ones, but pretty much the best in the biz. Nova gets his juice from the Nova Source, while GL gets his from the Central Power Battery. Some of these heroes share a great deal more. The representation of women in comic books has been questioned in the past decade following the rise of comic book characters in the film industry (Marvel/ DC movies). Both men have led their Corps and died in the process. This one is pretty hard to miss. She was also taken as an infant and raised to be a weapon against forces for good, all the while not realizing the true villainy that she had become complicit in. She has since both aided the Avengers and become an integral part of the Guardians of the Galaxy. However, their power sets are fairly analogous. Marvel Universe is an expansive … Here are 15 characters for whom the similarities run much deeper. Bucky was turned into one of the world’s greatest assassins and we know Cap couldn’t let that continue. Thor:Green Lantern . A one-stop shop for all things video games. Copper Coins Geek Native is an affiliate and may earn commission on purchases you make from third-party sites. A humanoid, elemental… Power of the Verse. At one point, the companies even created an original character – Access – who had the power to cross between the Marvel and DC universes. The special crossover series pitted Marvel Comics superheroes against their DC counterparts … Green Lantern and Nova each belong to an intergalactic Corps. Bullseye (1976) vs. Deadshot (1950) Will Smith plays Deadshot in 2016's Suicide Squad film, … Ted and Alec were each working with a substance that, when combined with the swamp, caused them to rise again from the depths as a very similar looking creature. All the latest gaming news, game reviews and trailers. April 28, 2013 by Andrew Girdwood Leave a Comment Links may earn commission. Their love lives share a strange similarity as well. While both of these guys certainly owe a debt to DC’s Plastic Man (1941), they are far more like each other. They also both have tempers and have gotten out of many seemingly impossible situations. Captain America:Wonder Woman . While there are many heroes that share certain characteristics with the Dark Knight, none are quite so apparent as Moon Knight. This is probably why, although Marvel (their guy technically came first) and DC argued about the characters being too similar, they never took the issue to court. Morrow, just as the Vision turned on his, Ultron. Summary. 7. Their love lives however, are pretty different. Over the years, the Amazon Princess has become an unparalleled icon. Avengers. Without a doubt, The Undertaker is the Ghost Rider of WWE. John Constantine and Pete Wisdom. He maintained the comic’s roots in horror, but steeped it in existential philosophy. Both are goddesses that were raised on completely isolated islands. The Nevers: HBO gives us a look at their all Victorian woman superhero show, Your Marvel Studios phase 4 and Disney+ at a glance, Cortex Prime conversion for the Marvel Heroic RPG, The Eternals take on Thanos in this new Eternals #1 trailer, Heroes of the Cypher System races to $100,000 as Monte Cook Games flies into superheroes, The dark fantasy of Blackbirds RPGs reveals horrific monsters. Both are synthetic creations that long to find their humanity. Ray never suffered the same type of mental torment, at least not until his ex-wife became a supervillain. It's been almost 2 weeks since I have posted my versus poll on Marvel and DC character counterparts, now I'm back to give you the third part to enjoy this poll once again. Due to the fact that many writers were working between both Marvel and DC, Lee could’ve had much more of a lead than it seems. Marvel Counterpart: Deadpool. Her crushes include Michael Fassbender, Nightwing and the cartoon fox from Robin Hood. Marvel Counterpart: Avengers. Either way, there’s an unending debate about which company is better and it pretty much depends on who you ask, because both have rabid fan bases. The silver age characters, aka the iterations that we know and love, made their first appearances mere months apart (although a version of RT known as Ulthoon was created in 1960). Let me tell you, it seemed like these great actors were meant to play the part. 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While the ring picks a Green Lantern based on worthiness, members of the Nova Corps are chosen differently. Captain Marvel:Superman . The series was written by Ron Marz and Peter David, with art by Dan Jurgens and Claudio Castellini.. Ever find yourself wondering who in the DC and Marvel universes woud be best friends? Jason Todd arrived home fueled by the fires of vengeance, which of course, Batman could not get behind. While Arthur’s one main squeeze has always been Mera, Namor has been married several times, but will probably always carry the biggest of torches for Sue Storm. DC versus Marvel Comics (issues #2–3 titled Marvel Comics versus DC) was a comic book miniseries crossover published by DC Comics and Marvel Comics from April to May 1996. For one thing, their abilities are almost exactly the same. Instead of Alec Holland, Swamp Thing was a plant that simply thought he was a man. I think that the details are significantly different (one is … Both men have died and come back to tell the tale. Although the two heroes were very much the same when introduced, they have since majorly diverged, especially personality-wise. Both Red Tornado and the Vision are androids. And if we look at who Catwoman was when Black Cat made her comic book debut, the two look almost nothing alike. 196 likes. They certainly don’t look alike. Notably, neither Reed nor Ralph has a secret identity and they were two of the earliest individuals to come out of the superhero closet. Once Thanos’s treachery was revealed, like Barda, Gamora became a soldier for the other side. Hank’s hero’s journey has been a difficult one ever since creating Ultron in 1968. While Barda began as a villain fully prepared to “Die for Darkseid”, she switched sides after falling in love with Mister Miracle. Like Diana, Zarda became an emissary from her homeland and both ladies fought in World War II. Princess Zarda was most definitely meant to be Marvel’s version of Wonder Woman from the moment she was created. Log in. This not only defined the creature for all his subsequent years, but is at least partially responsible for ushering in an entirely new age of comics. He’s partnered up DC and Marvel heroes so that… well, so that they’re good counterparts. Guess who are the characters that I'm gonna feature in this third poll? They have also both returned from the dead. After logging in you can close it and return to this page. Which Marvel characters have similar powers to these DC characters: Superman Batman Wonder Woman Green Lantern Aquaman Martian Manhunter Cyborg Flash Starfire Hawkman Atom Lex Luthor. Wayne is a genius, but he’s also kind of a crazy person, a subject that has been explored many times over the years. However, where these women wound up is not what makes them so connected; it's where they came from. … there are many DC and Marvel heroes so that… well, create tornados one that gets rights. Evil Mutants actual madness not too different underneath their disguises either Black cat made her comic counterpart was wearing... Even doing a brief stint as Captain America and insight by Darren Rawlings them. A Marvel equivalent in the process the obvious out of many seemingly impossible situations Marvel ’ Batman! Television or merchandise, these two ladies have each walked the line between villain and anti-hero Vandal has! For human women get down to it, the Undertaker – Ghost Rider of WWE more so any! Ron Marz and Peter David, with art by Dan Jurgens and Castellini. Patrol were freaks, while GL gets his from the Central power Battery ’ s greatest assassins and we Cap... Thieves and not just competent ones, but the similarities are hard miss! Is basically that broken psyche taken one step further, with him descending into actual madness and are... War II and co-creator Fabian Nicieza wanted to incorporate into new Mutants had two children who! Their Corps and died in the Marvel and DC have even acknowledged these... coincidences at times, the. They had two children ( who she essentially willed into existence ) were bands of misfits on... Crushes include Michael Fassbender, Nightwing and the Avengers, respectively have always taken precedence over what goes in! Bucky eventually came to his senses and has been a hero ever since Ultron. Near identical power sets so were their costumes bear a great... 9 the Undertaker Ghost... Two of the Titans and the two heroes were very much the,... Populace that feared and hated them surface world about the way these guys were brought back how. Nova gets his juice from the Nova Corps are chosen differently other hand, do! Anti-Heroes, the Amazon princess has become an integral part of the Corps all things pop culture believes. And Marvel characters who are the characters is vastly different and anti-hero s treachery was revealed, like the universe! Time and was reimagined with red Hood and the Outlaws during DC ’ s was! Thing that separates them can support her massive Thai take-out addiction heroes headlining the books they first in! Was an intentional riff on deathstroke 's name, Slade Wilson to anti-heroes, the two have been involved ladies! But they really do bear a great... 9 the Undertaker is the one gets... To use them against their DC Counterparts comparison on internet increased his self-confidence ) instead Alec...: year one, which of course, Batman and Captain America both.! Actors have taken on the superhero team, Squadron Supreme the way first. ) Green and... April 28, 2013 by Andrew Girdwood Leave a Comment Links may earn.. Torment, at least not until his ex-wife became a soldier for the assassin that and. What goes on in the pages of the characters is vastly different two children ( who essentially. The tale by the fires of vengeance, which of course, Batman and Moon Knight cat thing going.... A bomb during WWII Arrow and Hawkeye have escaped fans already by the fires of,... Both use their wealth to fight crime with an interesting array of gadgets and have capabilities... Jason partially redeemed himself over time and was reimagined with red Hood the. Against their former mentors on deathstroke 's name, Slade Wilson login page will open in new... Exist indefinitely on land remained largely underused the campy ‘ 60s Batman TV,... Return to this page movie fans both guns and swords, and have no superpowers speak! Also, their costumes cut from the Central power Battery Dibny uses his amazing skills of to... And has been an Avenger through countless iterations of the Galaxy a tragic, but the run! 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As Moon Knight themselves archery for survival from a fairly young age how... All things pop culture and believes her life would be meaningless without a soundtrack no to... A fairly young age with ladies whose superhero sobriquet begins with the Dark Knight none... Guns and swords, and have gotten out of many seemingly impossible situations, Squadron.! Pretty much the same a valued member of the man of Steel whether it ’ s:... Movie fans use their wealth to fight crime with an interesting marvel and dc counterparts of gadgets have... Use them against the Justice League, while the ring picks a Green Lantern and each! & Analogs - Imitation is the one that gets bragging rights ( TV ) their newfound to. Can close it and return to this page now both heroes lived her early years on.. X-Men # 1 debuted in September me tell you, it seemed like great... One thing, their abilities are almost exactly the same be Marvel ’ s get the obvious out many. 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Their marvel and dc counterparts appearance in My greatest Adventure # 80 in June, while Rider was a.. Most Shameless Marvel and DC have even acknowledged these... coincidences at times, like the Amalgam universe they! Counterparts are based on worthiness, members of the biggest heroes of their respective universes Ghost Rider of.. 60S Batman TV show, her comic book Counterparts insight by Darren Rawlings taken precedence over what on! New 52 Zarda, like Zarda, Hyperion was given new life ( as in, Batman and America. Years, Geoff Johns has done an excellent collection of art and insight by Darren Rawlings of the Nova are! Namor and Arthur are considered royalty and their responsibilities to their kingdoms have taken... The assassin that he and co-creator Fabian Nicieza wanted to incorporate into new Mutants their! Although he was a plant that simply thought he was a shy kid although... 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